#90: Am I Just My Brain and Other Deep Questions With Dr. Sharon Dirckx

Description:

Listen to enjoy a deep conversation on the nature of humanity and being curious about our own development. I and my guest, Dr. Sharon Dirckx, examine the power of beliefs, the nature of the human brain, tapping into empathy, and how AI will affect us all.

Bio:

Dr. Sharon Dirckx is a speaker and author (www.dirckx.org) whose work focuses on responding to the spiritual and faith-related questions that people ask today. Originally from a scientific background, she has a PhD in brain imaging from the University of Cambridge and speaks internationally on topics such as science and theology, human consciousness, and the problem of evil. Sharon has appeared several times on BBC Radio and has also written for The Times. She is the author of the award-winning book, Why? Looking at God, evil, and personal suffering (2013), Am I just my brain? (2019), and Broken Planet, on natural disasters, was released in February 2023.

Social Media: 

Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/sharondirckx?lang=en
Website: https://www.dirckx.org

Transcription:

(00:00):

Hello, I'm Tina Marie St. Cyr, and welcome to Light Your Life, the podcast. I believe our dreams have energy calling and purpose, and that when we move in their direction, our lives become even more joyful, fulfilled, and effortless. This podcast gives you insights to the strategies our guests use to overcome obstacles and manifest their dreams in business, career, relationships, and in life. Listen, to find new levels of energy, perspective, and courage, your journey to light your life begins now. Hello and welcome. I'm your host, Tina Marie Saints here. It's always wonderful to share time with you here, and the conversation that we're about to dive into, I promise you, will bring you new perspectives of life, of yourself, of others, of this thing we call our humanity that we're all in together. And so I invite you to see this as a reflection of how you're going to relate to yourself and others in our conversation today, and dive into your own topics of self-leadership and, and how you'd like to be that next level person that we all aim to be and grow to be.

(01:18):

And as we say here, light your life. We wanna stay curious because we might just learn something <laugh>. And so I'm gonna introduce our wonderful guest today. Her name is Dr. Sharon Dericks, and she's a speaker and an author whose work focuses on responding to the spiritual and faith related questions that we ask ourselves today. Originally from a scientific background, which we're gonna dive into and understand her background even more. Sharon, Dr. Sharon owns or has a PhD and brain imaging from the University of Cambridge and speaks internationally on topics such as science and theology. Yes, those two go together human consciousness and the problem of evil. So Sharon has appeared several times on the BBC radio and has written for the Times, and also is the author of three books. If you're taking notes, I want you to write these down 'cause they're fascinating.

(02:15):

And the, the journey of her writing is, is a fascination I have that we're gonna unpack today. First, the book, why Looking at God Evil and Personal Suffering. Then am I Just My Brain, which was a book that attracted me to her work. And then most recently here in the, the most recent year, Sharon's book, broken Planet on Natural Disasters. And then the Journey of people in her book that she follows, which is very well written. So Dr. Sharon, thank you so much for being our guest here today. Oh, it's a pleasure, Tina. Thanks for having me. It's wonderful. I was sharing before we started that highlighting great thinkers of our world allows us to have new perspectives into ourselves. And many times people can dive into a book or a podcast or, you know, watch a lecture on YouTube such as that. But what I find interesting is when we courageously go into conversation and say, let's see what, you know, blooms or comes from just the, the, the thread of curiosity as we sit together here. That's

(03:26):

Awesome. Fantastic. I'm all about conversation.

(03:28):

Yay. So I, I like to open with, especially in your writings, it prompted this question to have a curiosity of what was your upbringing like whenever it came to the nature of belief or values or spirituality or religion. Take us back into that young Sharon's upbringing.

(03:49):

Yeah, so I was raised in a very loving home. And I was, you know, I had very loving parents that really cared for my brother and I and felt very secure in that, in that home life. But it wasn't one in which sort of religious beliefs were talked about or shared or expressed. So I would describe it as a, a religiously neutral upbringing, which on one level was meant that there wasn't anything negative that I associated with well, faith and in particular the Christian faith that had to be undone at a later stage. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> on the other side. I really literally knew nothing. I I literally knew nothing about the Christian faith. And so it was a really a blank slate for me. And I went to Sunday school maybe a handful of times growing up, but as I share in my, my book and my, just my brain that I had this moment of as a child sitting by a window slightly bored and suddenly having an awareness of my own consciousness and these kind of big questions of life started to bubble to the surface.

(05:08):

And it's fascinating really, that that wasn't being encouraged by my context. And yet they came up nonetheless. And, and probably that was the start of a journey for me that took many years. But I did end up changing my views about God from being, I don't know, agnostic. I've never really thought about it to. Yeah. I think there's something to this. So

(05:29):

That's beautiful. And so I was curious, whenever I read that in your book, I, I pictured you by the window <laugh> <laugh> looking outside, and these thoughts come in <laugh>. And I was wondering, did she have a perception of herself different than the thoughts that were coming in? Or were they still, did it still seem like it was your identity having the thought?

(05:47):

Yeah, I still thought I was me <laugh>, but why, why could I think why, why did I exist? Yeah. And why am I thinking, why am I a thinking being Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, I, I just was aware of my own existence and why I was there, and that's Yeah.

(06:06):

A beautiful thing because I can't say that I think of many young children even having consciousness of something. So the theoretical <laugh>,

(06:17):

I think the problem now is that we don't have true boredom in the sense that we had it ah, back then in the, oh, I mean, what do I mean by that? I mean, whenever we are in on the brink of a moment, like the one I was having, right? We pick up our phones and kind of tap away or doom scroll or, and that is a distraction away from the potential of thinking about a really big question that could lead you to some very interesting conversation. I think there is something about we don't really have time to mentally FreeWheel Mm-Hmm. These days. That is a,

(06:56):

A beautiful perspective and very a stout. So the interesting thing there is, I, I was also that Bo Child <laugh>, we didn't grow up with these devices around us Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. But I'm reminded of this, the quote, so the Bible I've read every now and then, you know, and throughout, you know, my growing years, I'm 54 now. And there's certain lines that I think we all can resonate with independent of our religious upbringing. But there's one, you know, be still and know that I am. Right. And, and so the stillness is what you're speaking of. You know, we could say it's boredom because the mind wants to be doing, but that stillness becomes that container of becoming and where those questions surfaced for yourself as a young girl. Yeah. How beautiful. And so you touched on the, the, you know, the interesting thing of, of going from your doctorate, which I wanna unpack, and then having this new awareness of yourself and you know, going into theology and, and, and, and studies of that you know, background. So what interested you in, in, in brain imaging and, and studying the brain?

(08:09):

Yeah. Well, it's it was a long journey. I mean, a few years after that moment by the window, I actually, as a teenager I didn't think about what I believed, but I knew that I loved the sciences, and I knew I wanted to be a scientist. And so I went on to make that a priority. As much as I could choose what I could study, science was at the, the front. So physics, chemistry, biology, I took them for my high school subjects, and then I studied them at a level, which in the UK is, is what you do to get into university. So I studied biology, chemistry, and maths at a level Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And then went to university to study biochemistry. And I just loved studying the natural world. I love that, that it was so beautiful and complex but also ordered.

(09:02):

And I had all of these different components. I just loved it. And I know it's not everyone's thing Mm-Hmm. It's not my children's thing I'm discovering, but it, it was my thing. And so and, but yeah, but I think also along the way had somehow absorbed the view that these mechanisms are all we need to know about. And they explained the whole of life. And I remember my A level biology teacher giving me a copy of Richard Dawkins book, the Selfish Gene, which had just come out a few years earlier. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> telling us that we are gene machines, you know, and the purpose of our life is to be carriers of our DNA right. To the next generation. And I kind of absorbed this without really critiquing it or thinking about it. And it really wasn't until later that I did that. And, and that's the interesting thing. I arrived at university loving science, not really having thought about what I really believed. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and probably in agnostic, you know? Yeah, not, not skeptical, not kind of really vocal about that. God definitely doesn't exist, but I, I just had absorbed the view that science had all of the answers and yeah.

(10:20):

Yeah. It's a common view, you know? Yeah. I grew up with that as well. And as you were reflecting on that young version of yourself, so in love with science, I was that person too, and I felt like, so here in the States, we call it a nerd <laugh>. And so I was very, I

(10:38):

Was very much, you're calling me a nerd.

(10:39):

Yeah. I'm calling you a nerd, <laugh>. Thank you. We're nerds together. Right. And so I remember I think I was about nine whenever, you know, we have that Christmas list, what would you love for your Christmas presents and I wanted chemistry sets, <laugh>

(10:56):

Nice.

(10:56):

I wanted every chemistry set that, that could possibly be placed in my room under my, my, my watch, you know? And I remember setting up my just inherently setting up my bedroom as a lab. I mean, I, I hadn't come across

(11:11):

Labs. Oh, you remember doing that?

(11:13):

Right. And so I brought in the folding tables from the garage and, and set them up. I had all my little test tubes and, and everything, and my vials, and I knew I ordered everything. I had my elements <laugh> up on the wall and I had been studying and I just, I was fascinated by science and especially astronomy. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and cellular chemistry. And I remember studying <laugh>, DNA, you know, as a young girl in grade school. And there wasn't anything there in my science. Everything was, you know, examine a leaf or <laugh> or examine, you know, like here. Yeah. Or the different, you know what do they call 'em, but the classes of animals and things of that nature. But growing up in science as a girl, you know it wasn't common. I had a lot of people that I could look to that were male in science, but not so much female.

(12:06):

But I did go into chemistry. My first, my first degree is in chemistry. I love organic chemistry. And then I was gonna be, oh, yeah, I was gonna be, no, it's fascinating. I was gonna be a geologist. And then I realized that seemed really boring, <laugh>. I was like, okay, <laugh>. I, I like the earth and play tectonics. But yeah, I think, I think I, I wanna go into something more dynamic. And so my physical chemistry beliefs or, or just studies of anatomy and the biochemistry of the cell led me into nutrition study nutrition. And then that led me into thinking. Right. Yeah. And so the thinking place. And so I wanna take us to that place in your history where you went to the lectures here you are a scientist among scientists, and you go to the lectures and you, you ran into a cohort of scientists that also believed in the unseen and, and things of the nature of God. So can you take us to that lecture and, and how that was pivotal in your own perception?

(13:11):

Absolutely. so I in my very first week was invited to an event which was called Gorilla Christian. And that's where there were four Christians in a room that was quite big. And, and so this room was full of people. And I, I decided to go along and I listened to all of these questions being addressed to these, this panel of people. And eventually halfway through the evening, I plucked up courage, and I put my own hand up and asked my own question of, surely you can't believe in God and be a, a scientist at the same time, you know, we can't be a thinker and a person of faith. These two just don't go together. And of course, I, I was given the answer that yes, you can. These are, you know, asking someone to choose between scientific methods and belief in God. It's like asking someone to choose between the programs and processes underlying Microsoft Office and the existence of Bill Gates.

(14:17):

Ah, and of course, we think about that for a moment and see, you don't need to choose these actually together, give you a more complete understanding of why Microsoft Office exists. And in fact, trying to make sense of it without reference to Bill Gates leaves you with a diminished understanding. You know, the processes is only part of the picture. And so that, for me was, was actually really helpful to think that there are different ways of looking at the world. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and the sciences are beautiful and elegant and you to study that, but that actually, there are other questions that science can't answer. Right. That was never intended to answer, that are found in in faith-based questions.

(15:04):

Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it's beautiful.

(15:06):

So that, that, yeah. And that for me, was actually a game changer. I'd never heard anything like that before. I'd never realized that there were reasons and arguments that you could give in favor of the possibility that God might exist. I guess, you know, the UK is, is much more secular than, than the States in some areas. And so that set me grilling a lot more Christians and asking a lot more questions in the years, in the next year Mm-Hmm. Of my life.

(15:37):

It sparked your curiosity. That's one of our themes here, right? <Laugh> <laugh>,

(15:41):

You know, you know what, everyone's into curiosity at the moment. It's one of these words that everyone's Yeah. School.

(15:48):

It's good. I, I think that if we stay curious, we, we become humble. Hmm. And we have that element of, of the not knowing inside of us. Yeah. when I studied the Buddhist faith there was a, because I've studied all the world religions not as in depth as I could say, I'm a master at any of them. Right. yet I grew up in a household where my parents, specifically my mother invited me to study them. She said, you know, go find different answers than what we have here. Go, go ask questions that, you know, we don't ask you. And so she invited me to read the Koran and, and read, you know texts of Buddhism. And in Buddhism, there's a knowing or at least a theory philosophy, that there's more not knowing than there is knowing. And, and so it helps us relax into the not knowing, because it's, it's a partner in our becoming as opposed to something that we would fear. And that if we adventure into wanting to know everything, then we lose the magic of life itself. Right. when we explain everything away, <laugh>,

(16:57):

Well, then there are some things that we can't know that, that, and, and this is the, the the, the, the problem with the view that science can answer every question that we have. That, that there are some things that sit beyond our capability, our, our human comprehension. Mm-Hmm. I believe that there are parts of God that we can understand, but there are also things that are kind of beyond understanding. And so, and beyond knowing in that sense

(17:28):

Yeah. Until we get to maybe a different level of whatever the thing life is. Right. That brings me to this question of your perspectives on human identity. Mm-Hmm. And so, you know, the concept of human identity can be related in a scientific way of its need to find protection, safety, belonging, and it's part of a mechanism of survival and our, our base evolution. So have you discovered in your studies a perspective on the need for humans to have identity? And, and does it hold us back? Or does it actually become a foundation for our, our evolution?

(18:05):

Well, I, that's a, a great question. I think that, I think that everyone has an identity of sorts and people that have sought to kind of wipe the slates clean and say that there is no, there, there is no ultimate kind of human identity. And it's up to us to create it. I think it was Jean Paul Satch that, that said that then we still then end up creating something. There seems to be this innate need to have identity and to possess it in some way. And people place their identity in all kinds of things. Some people, it's in their family, in their family history, some people, it's in their career and their sense of achievement and what they do in the world. And in fact, a lot of us fall into that category. We are what we do, what we produce. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But actually if, if the Judeo-Christian framework is true, then it's possible that identity isn't something that we need to earn or achieve.

(19:08):

It's something that's actually given to us. Mm. You know, right at the beginning of the, you know, the American Constitution, the United Nations human rights convention talks about all humans are created equal. Right. and, and what that mean where that comes from is Genesis, which says that, you know, humans are made in the image of God. In other words, they all have intrinsic value and worth before they do anything, before they say anything. And it, it's a result of being made by God who loves them and sees them and knows them. And actually, if you can have a rootedness of that kind that says, you are seen, known, and loved right. Before you do anything useful in the swell, even if you are incapable of doing anything useful, that you have value and worth, and, and actually that, that's beautiful is incredibly liberating. To be that rooted and that accepted is liberating. And, and that's what I came to discover in my life. I'm not sure that it serves evolutionary purpose. Mm-Hmm. Evolution is more geared towards survival and adaptation. But this kind of goes, goes beyond that into, you know, what is it that's gonna root us Mm-Hmm. Relationally and socially and, and in all kinds of ways.

(20:34):

I love that. And you said, you know, it has us, I mean, this is a beautiful concept. I'd like us to just pause and reflect on that. There's this inherent want and need and desire in humans, every single one of us to be seen, known, and heard. And what you're reflecting on is that the God of our choosing or, or that power, the, you know something other than us is in partnership with us and is already valued us in this way you know, unconditionally to see us, hear us and know us. And so we've, we've already started off with a partnership, haven't we? Mm-Hmm.

(21:18):

Yeah. Except maybe you know, I, I would probably say that it's not necessarily the God of our choosing, but the God who has revealed himself in history in the Judea Christian framework, because the context into which there are other gods, there are other deities available. True, but they don't all put forward this view of human inherent dignity and value. For example, the context into which Genesis was written was one of Polytheism where there were Babylonian, Babylonian Mesopotamian creation stories that sit alongside the Genesis creation story. And in those stories, the humans were made as slaves to the gods. Their role was functional. They existed to serve the deity, and that was where they got their inherent value from. But the author of Genesis is actually saying something quite different to saying that actually you exist because I've made you, and because you are, you have a value in who you are, not in what you do, and you're not needed to perform a certain function. So I guess I would say that it's found in a particular framework of faith, but not necessarily every framework.

(22:38):

I love, I I love that. Thank you for that distinction. That was very well articulated. And I, I can connect with that. I can see that definitely. So it's not becoming an object Yeah. To the gods and something that is needed to perform or to do, as you say. But instead, it's something that, of being just simply because you are there is value.

(23:05):

Yeah.

(23:06):

Beautiful. Beautiful. And so that, that sparks this crazy thought. Bear with me here. And so we are in this like it or not era of ai artificial intelligence. And my mind has wondered, you know, what is this going to be and do and, and, and impact? How is it going to impact the human identity our, our being, our value, you know, how we see ourselves? Are we inherently putting ourselves at a risk of our own human identity? Or is it going to allow us to go deeper into our true identity and, and move away for so much doing because robotics and whatnot will do the doing? And do we then return to our essence? I was just curious about your perspectives on the, the artificial intelligence of our world and where things are possibly going. Yeah, yeah.

(23:59):

Great question. And I think that, you know, my book, am I just my brain in a way, the answer that you give to the question, am I just, my brain impacts what we believe will one day be possible with, with ai. And the problem, actually with the, the language that's already been introduced, we're talking about artificial intelligence, is that it sounds human. Mm-Hmm. Because the word intelligence is an, is a word that we are also ascribed to human capacity to know and gain, gain knowledge and express it, and so on. But of course, in ai, really what it refers to is the ability to crunch data and process information, and of course, ai in a na in the sense of narrow ai, which is a where a human being has programmed an algorithm to specifically perform a very focused task. It's improving life in all kinds of ways by increasing, you know, performing far better than humans ever could. Mm-Hmm. You know, and, and, and so many areas of life, you know bomb disposal, you know prescription drugs I mean, I'm forgetting all the precision,

(25:15):

Precision,

(25:17):

Precision medical diagnoses and so on are being done to greater accuracy with greater efficiency than humans ever could, and that, that is extraordinary. And we, we welcome that. That's a good thing. But does it mean that one day Androids will possess all of the qualities that humans have and be able to surpass them in every way? Well, I would say no. There are some that believe that that is the case, but if, well, if you believe that humans are entirely physical and that human consciousness is chemicals in your brain, then in theory it could be replicated. But if we believe there's more to a human being than just the physical, then there may be some parts of our humanity that can never be replicated. And, and certainly when we think about what it is that is most central to being human, it's the things we've already talked about.

(26:15):

It's about being seen and heard and known and loved. And just because an Android can crunch data and give you a, a human sounding response, doesn't mean they've listened. It doesn't mean they've heard, and it doesn't mean you are loved. Yeah. Just because something has the appearance of human consciousness doesn't mean that it is Mm-Hmm. Conscious. I think one of the biggest challenges that we will have in the future is distinguishing between the appearance of consciousness in an Android and algorithm and a human being. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> expressing that. So I think that's one of our biggest challenges.

(26:55):

It is. And I, I love that we're talking about this because I've, I've had some concerns that the generations that grow up alongside this artificial intelligence, if that's what we end up yeah. Continuing to name it will form a relationship with it. And, and the humanity, what I see us being is humans, is you, you touch on the word that I love, it's called love <laugh>, is that we have this emotional center that needs expression. And whenever we're putting ourselves emotionally into the context of another human we can have a different relationship that feels as though there's an energetic connection and a transference of these emotions. And that's how we get our needs met. Right. And so, a concern I have is these generations coming up alongside ai. It may not be our, you know, first level generation right now, but, you know, take ourselves, you know, 10, 20 years in the future, it's gonna be quite common. And I even see emotional responses to Siri. You know, like Siri says something and you, you get angry with Siri, or, or Yeah. You call Siri names or you go, thank you, Siri. I, I say Thank you to my AI <laugh> Yeah. And I'm like, it's a computer <laugh>. But then will it change our emotional recognition of, you know, how we get our needs met as humans in the future? It's a, it's a concerning topic.

(28:20):

Yeah. I think it depends on whether we want to see AI as a substitute for human relationships or as something that should work alongside human relationships. And I think, yes. You know, part of how that will play out is the, the more socially integrated somebody is, the less in the less influence the, the AI will have on them, even if they're using it very, you know, very well and very closely in lots of different ways. I think if we stay connected to other people, then hopefully we'll retain that ability to, to discern, distinguish, and to discern. But if, if we disappear into a world of algorithms and electronics, then I think we're in danger. And I think, again, that's another conversation. What role should AI have? Should it be as equal and e equal to human beings? Or should it be something that we can use and work, work with? But actually, you know, they're still, I don't want to use the word subservient, 'cause that sounds derogatory, but they are subject to Mm-Hmm. Human beings.

(29:33):

So it takes me back to that original dichotomy of the view of God, right. That if we see the God that saw us as subjects that we're doing for it, <laugh>, then, you know, we're also now saying, we will have that relationship with ai. You know, we know that it is serving us as opposed to being us. Right.

(29:56):

And, and with that comes a responsibility for human beings to, to make sure that AI is used for human flourishing, not for human oppression. And I think the stage that we're at, at the moment, particularly with the resignation of people like Jeffrey Hinton from Google last year, because of his concerns about it, and calling for a moratorium in order for regulation to catch up with the technology. Right. I think one of the biggest challenges is how we regulate, and that human beings do have a responsibility to steward AI in a way that enables human flourishing and, and doesn't suppress it. And we're probably already in that place where it's being used for good and for harm, not

(30:42):

So good <laugh>. Yeah. And that comes back to ethics, you know, how are we going to, yeah. And it's becoming an global ethical conversation because this is a global experience we're all having. And that, so that takes me to, my next question is on the human emotion scale empathy and, and how we, you know, see empathy, especially, you know, whenever you take your background of science which could be very, you know, linear and, and statistical and factual. And in my understanding and in my experience, you know, removing emotion from the equation and then we bring in the concepts of, of God and, and something of a, of a nature of seeing you valuing you believing in you, you know, <laugh> you know, allowing you to grow in ways that you haven't. Empathy seems to be this connector that will allow us to stay human and even connect us deeper into our, our, the essence of humanity. So I was just curious about your thoughts on the emotion of empathy and the future of that.

(31:51):

Wow. well I haven't thought too much specifically about it but I, I think we definitely need it. And, you know, I think it's Brene Brown that's got this great TEDx talk or Ted talk about the distinction between sympathy and empathy and Oh, yeah. In, in, in relation to like, somebody that's in a pit, you know, sympathy stands at the top, and waves, hello. I'm really sorry that you're in there going through that difficult time and empathy climbs down the ladder to be in the pit with, with the person. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. There's something about being very present with people, and particularly with a person in pain. And we've, we've all been there in different ways, and it's part of what I talk about in my books on suffering that we mustn't lose this capacity, and sometimes we suppress it by coming out with our slightly off patched phrases about, oh, I know exactly what you're going through. Right. Which we, we don't really, because everyone is different and unique of course we can have similar experiences, but allowing for that uniqueness allowing for,

(33:01):

Oh, I think actually empathy often resides in silence as well. There's is remarkable. One of the oldest chronologically, the oldest book of the Bible is the Book of Job. And it begins with this most human experience of suffering. And his three fr the whole thing is about his three friends come and they're really terrible at his bedside, you know suggesting that he is to blame for his suffering, but before they open their mouths, they spend a week in silence, and they are just capturing the, the depth of what he's going through. And I think there's something about we've lost the ability to be silent at the right time, and then to find the right words at the right time. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And I think those are very important. The thing that I find most encouraging about my Christian faith is that you know, God has become a human, he has climbed down the ladder to be with us in the pit as the person of Jesus Christ. And ultimately, you can give all the answers you like, but that's the one that I keep landing on, that actually God knows 'cause he's been there.

(34:14):

And that's, that's actually the anchor that I keep coming back to when I'm in that pit.

(34:20):

Yeah.

(34:21):

And there's empathy there as well, because he, he knows. Yeah. So we have that in, in God, which is extraordinary,

(34:29):

And he takes the time to know, right. Mm-Hmm. And there's no I think there's a, I know we all went through this thing called the Pandemic here recently, <laugh> Oh, yeah. For whatever course of work that was. And I love, in your book of suffering, the, you know, you, we talk about the natural disasters and the pandemic was one of those. I love that. You know, it seems as though the Jesus of our upbringing are the ones that we've studied. The one, the person that we studied didn't make assumptions. And I, I think, you know, there, there's a discord and human thinking where we jump to assumption and, and doing that distances us from the possibility of actually learning and being empathetic with the other.

(35:19):

Yeah. Yeah. And your, your point about curiosity is really important, isn't it? That and what Jesus is really good at was asking questions. He asked a load of questions. Yeah. If we read through the biographies of his life, it's, he didn't just make these blanket kind of one-liner religious statements. He was actually, he had conversations with people and he asked them questions, and he respected their dignity as well as offered them extraordinary hope and life at the same time. Yeah.

(35:51):

And those breakthrough questions that we wouldn't have consciousness of until we have an outside force asking us in. And we're like, oh, well, there's another perspective, isn't it, <laugh>?

(35:59):

Yeah.

(36:00):

Well, thank you for that <laugh> <laugh>, and that's what we can be for each other with grace. Right? Yeah. Grace and that judgment. So when asked two more questions, I've loved our time together. One is your mom. And I was just curious, how old are your children?

(36:20):

They are 15 and, no, wait, sorry, they're 14 and 16.

(36:24):

Okay. So they've, they've come through what we would say their formative years, and now they're adventuring into their independence. And and so I'm curious about your perspectives of the world that they're being launched into you know, from your mother's perspective, what do you think about for your children in, in the world they're inheriting?

(36:44):

Yeah. well, I think that they are in a world that we didn't grow up in. And in a sense it's a harder world because it's lived on online now. My children are very good at having good boundaries actually with social media, but it's then nonetheless and right. You can see what everyone else doing. So FOMO is a much bigger thing than it probably was when we were younger, even though we had it, but we didn't have it to the same extent every day in, you know, in our palms as it were. So I think the impact of social media, and there are, I think there is data emerging now, isn't there? About what that's really doing to young people. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And they'll be, you know, it'll take case, even their

(37:32):

Brain

(37:33):

<Laugh>, even their brain,

(37:34):

You know, and, and how the nerve, and I think nerves and synapses work and fire,

(37:39):

Right? Neuroplasticity is a thing. It's at work the whole of your life. And I think that definitely in young people, the kind, like the attention span that they work to has shortened. And that's not to say that it can't lengthen again. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, but be, I mean, if we if my husband and I show our kids a movie that we used to, like, sometimes we'll feel like, God, this is so slow, <laugh>, this is really slow. Like every frame is like 50 seconds. Whereas actually it, it actually is more like 15 or even 10 for a young person. They used to kind of, things move really quickly. So the way that we communicate with them, how we connect has really changed. Hmm. And I guess our generation, we need to adapt and but also I think they, they need to also recover that art of reading. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I'm always on my kids to read,

(38:43):

Right? <Laugh>,

(38:44):

And they are doing, and they are doing. But I think it is a dying art that we need to kind of fight for somehow, because books and literature are there to be read. And yes, you can do a YouTube summary of it if you want, but it's not quite the same thing, is it? As the book itself

(39:03):

Isn't? Yeah. I remember whenever we were younger, the CliffNotes came out, right. And so some of my my colleagues in, in, in college would go read the cliff note version of something to cram for the exam. And I, I remember thinking, wow, that's just such a travesty. 'cause You didn't really learn the book or the characters. And so I, I avoided CliffNotes <laugh> as I thought they were, you know evil. If we're talking about evil,

(39:35):

<Laugh> <laugh>, excellent.

(39:38):

But there's a, there's a study that I read about, and I wanna always find that golden nugget or that silver lining and how things are going. And I don't wanna be that person. And I know you don't either wanna be that person that thinks like, oh, there's doom, right? Like, <laugh> things are not going well. You know, we could tell ourselves that story. And I didn't want to grow old being that person. Well, when I was younger then and so the, the, the beautiful golden nugget was, you know, looking for the Juul in this shorter timeframe for absorbing information. Because if we look at a toxin that we have in our, in our age right now, information is a toxin because it's from everywhere and so many sources and what's true and what isn't. Right. And so the the, the paper that I read said, what if the human brain is being trained to observe and relate to information quicker so that it can process it quicker?

(40:38):

And this is where it just jumped. It went from, you know, we'll be able to inherently communicate with each other without words, because we'll get great at our innate intelligence and intuition <laugh> so that we could have space travel. So where that came from was whenever we're going at the speed of light, we have to do things pretty fast, <laugh>. So I was like, that's an interesting theory, <laugh>, of going so far from where we are in the physical plane with our human brain and consciousness and whatnot to something Yes. That if we're evolving into space travel, that we must yeah. Communicate a lot faster. <Laugh>.

(41:14):

Well, there's a lot in there to unpack. There's a lot,

(41:19):

But I was just putting a silver lining in this for our future generations, <laugh>.

(41:23):

Yeah, absolutely. Certainly they think quickly, don't they? And yeah. And fast. I'm sure there are. They talk fast. Yeah. <laugh> fast. You can fit more in <laugh>.

(41:33):

You can. That's awesome.

(41:34):

Yeah. Yeah.

(41:35):

So what's next for Sharon? What's the, where's your curiosity leading you?

(41:42):

Oh, well I, I am kinda spending some time I want to figure out ways to try and write more to a culture that doesn't know what they believe. And to have to try and kinda write in have a voice in kind of kinda newspaper, that kinda realm. Obviously online and, and a hard copy. That's something that I've always longed to do. I feel just a real passion to do that. And obviously would love to write more books. And if that's, you know, you know, Lord willing, I would love that. Hoping to kind of co-author a book which is looking at one of the biographies of Jesus life, but through the lens of the eyes of someone that has never read this before. And so what would they notice and what do I, what do we need to explain so that they can understand the key point, the key themes and threads of, of that biography. So that would be Mark's gospel hopefully. And then I'm also starting to think about the spiritual realm, because a lot of people do believe that there's a spiritual realm. I think the, in a sense, I think it seems like atheism or very, very, you know, very strict atheism is on the decline, but a lot of people would call themselves spiritual. Right? and so I want to try and write something for that audience.

(43:18):

That's beautiful. I love your scientists mind evaluating. I could see it like, yeah, your, your eyes are going up like this, structuring it, you know, like, I think we're, yeah. We're both scientists at heart, right? Yeah. And so I think in formulas, <laugh>, <laugh> within, you know, where's the formula gonna gonna have the outcome? You know, that delta that we're looking for Yes. To have the impact into humanities you know, next becoming.

(43:43):

Yeah. Yeah.

(43:44):

Thank you for your work. I wanna remind our listeners and our audience first thank you for diving into this wonderful conversation with us and partnering with us in, in in your consciousness listening to what we've brought forth. And I wanna remind that Sharon, Dr. Sharon's books are, are just pivotal. And it's interesting because there seems to be an evolution of journey for yourself in these books. And so I know I'm gonna go back. I, I have not yet read why <laugh>, as you know so many of us in our youth, we ask so many questions, don't we? And this one is looking at God evil and personal suffering, which that, that just feels like it calls to the soul, right? And then the one that had me fall in love with your thinking was, am I just my brain? Which really questions the neuroscience and the belief of what we are from a physical chemical existence and why we are, and how we evolved and why we're even a life form into something that allows us to realize there's much more that we do not yet know of our existence and why we're here. And then your most recent book of Broken Planet, it was a journey of, is it four families or maybe five that you, you followed through natural disasters that they experienced and, and what they've learned. Yeah. I

(45:04):

Think it might be more like nine or 10. I can't remember the exact number, but I tried to cover all the different kinds of natural disaster, like earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunamis,

(45:13):

Flooding, so flooding.

(45:14):

Yeah. Flooding. Yeah.

(45:15):

Yeah. Which is fascinating. 'cause We're not gonna unlive that. I mean, it is part of our existence here on the planet earth, right? Yeah. and I love that you've dove into that experience of us as a human race dealing with disasters as a, a human population as opposed to just a country or a, you know, community going through it. We all go through them, right? Yeah,

(45:39):

Absolutely. Especially in the southern USAI mean, you've had more than your fair share of, of disasters. Yeah.

(45:46):

The only thing that's, that's constant is the increase of insurance rates <laugh> because oh gosh. We have another one that comes and we're like, oh, gotta pay for that <laugh>. That's kind of fun. Yeah. Oh my goodness. Yeah. There, there, you know, not to make light of the loss of life in natural disasters, but yeah, it's, it's quite chaotic. If you want uncertainty, move to the South <laugh>. It's good. And so Dr. Sharon Dericks I want to spell your last name for our listeners 'cause it's a beautiful spelling. Is that like an Irish background or what is that spelling? It's Dutch.

(46:18):

Dutch, actually. My, my husband's father was Dutch. Oh,

(46:21):

Awesome. I I'd never seen that spelling. So www mm-Hmm.

(46:27):

<Affirmative>, D-I-R-C-K-X for X-ray do org is my website. Actually. I love it. If you're interested. Yeah.

(46:36):

Yes. D as in dogma, <laugh>, <laugh>, ir, and it was IRC as in Charlie. K Yeah, X as in X-ray dot org, which is beautiful. And we will definitely follow you and keep track of all your advancements and what you're doing for all of us here to help us, you know, just adventure into our own becoming, you know, as long as we stay curious and open as a container, we learn, and I strongly believe we're not, we're more not knowing than we're knowing. So if we relax into the not knowing, then we feel a lot more at ease, <laugh> with life itself. Thank you for your time here today on our, our Little podcast.

(47:15):

Well, thank you so much, team. I've, I've really loved our conversation. I love what you're doing.

(47:20):

You're awesome. I really appreciate you. Thank you.

(47:23):

Thank you.

(47:26):

Okay, so I'm pulling from the famous hat some questions here for Dr. Sharon Dericks. What book has made the biggest impact of your life?

(47:37):

That's a really great question. Do you know it's a book that I can't even remember the name of, sadly. I, I wish I could give you like a really famous book that everyone's heard of.

(47:50):

Right.

(47:51):

But it was a book that I read as an undergrad while I was grilling lots of Christians thinking about what I believed. And it was a book that taught me about the reliability of the New Testament, about why we can actually trust those documents as being historically reliable. And it and, and I remember reading that and just thinking, why hasn't anyone told me this earlier? Right. It's like the world's best kept secret. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. So unfortunately, I can't remember the name of that book, and I know that there are many others that have been written since then, but it was prior to all of those very excellent books like Amy or Ewings, why Trust The Bible and so on. Beautiful.

(48:33):

Thank you.

(48:33):

But yeah, that was

(48:34):

It. And if you ever think of it, just give us a text. <Laugh>. Yeah. I pulled another one. It's, if you could meet any historical figure, who would you choose and why?

(48:43):

Apart from Jesus

(48:45):

<Laugh>. Yeah. I would choose Jesus. That's who I choose. Like,

(48:47):

I

(48:48):

Would like, but I would, I mean, like, he's like my guy, you know, like,

(48:51):

Yeah.

(48:52):

Sit down and go, I've got some questions. <Laugh>,

(48:54):

I mean, apart from Jesus Mm-Hmm. I would probably go with maybe someone like Winston Churchill.

(49:00):

Ah, yeah.

(49:01):

Because I just think he was a fascinating person. Not perfect, of course, but Right. Really knew his own mind and, and knew how to lead. And I'd have lots of questions to ask him.

(49:14):

Yeah. And, and that one human emotion we tapped into was empathy. I think Mr. Winston Churchill definitely possessed a lot of empathy. Yeah. Especially, you know, for the people that were, were at the other end of the violence that was happening in the world. Right. And the last question, this was fun. It was a torn up, little mangled piece of paper, <laugh> one thing you would do differently if you had the choice. Okay. That's, that's a cool, you know, one thing I guess in your, in your choices of life that you would've done differently if you had the choice.

(49:51):

Ah, wow. I don't know. I might have actually done a, a PhD or a master's in some sort of philosophy or theology. Yeah. yeah. I've more sort of learned as I've gone along, but I wonder if I'd taken time to study that, that, you know, that would've been beneficial as well. That's awesome.

(50:21):

Yeah. I love that you're an academic and it seems like that's at your heart. You know, always learning, which is

(50:27):

Beautiful. I'm, I'm also a reflector, so once we've signed off, I'll think of some brilliant response that I should have given about You're funny, what I would do differently. <Laugh>

(50:37):

I know that you're a lecturer, so there there's a saying that there are three speeches we give. One is the one we practice, one is the one that we give, and the last is the one we wish we would've given <laugh>.

(50:46):

Exactly. Oh, I

(50:47):

Should have said that. Right. <laugh>, there's another, there's another question here that's gonna come from me because I, I don't know where it is specifically in the hat, but it's you know, if you could change one thing about human behavior or thinking what would be that one thing that you would see change more rapidly for human behavior that would benefit us all?

(51:11):

That's a it's a really fascinating question and lots of layers there. I think it's the capacity to well, the most important commandment from the words of Jesus to love God with everything you've got, and love your neighbor as yourself. I think if we did those things, like they, they said in just a few words, but they have the potential to change the world. Absolutely. To love your neighbor as yourself. And that means don't, you don't have to stop loving yourself, but to actually consider your neighbor even though they're not perfect either. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And to love them as yourself and to love God, and allow him to help you to do those things. What kind of a world would we live in?

(52:03):

Oh, that would be so amazing. I love that. Thank you. When I see people, you know, possibly doing harm to another person or, or having ill judgment or, or things that feel disparaging I, in my mind I go, if that were your mother, would you speak to her that way? Or if that were your beloved, you know, would you act in such ways? And it reminds me of that. Right? Yeah. So if, if you have someone you consider a beloved someone that you highly respect, trust, and would protect with your life, would you treat your neighbor in such ways? Yeah. And so that's what I feel, you know, Jesus was asking us to be and do in that, in that statement.

(52:47):

Yeah. Right. That's really profound.

(52:49):

That's awesome. Thank you for answering our questions from the hat <laugh>.

(52:53):

You are, it's a pleasure. <Laugh>, you're awesome.

(52:55):

They're fun. Some people like you. I love that you actually pondered. You went in and you're like, okay, I gotta think about this. This is great. So

(53:01):

People just scratch the head. Yeah.

(53:03):

Scratch the head. Think. I appreciate that

(53:06):

<Laugh>.

(53:08):

That was so energizing. I have takeaways that will help my life, and I'm sure you do too. To get show notes, bonuses, gifts for you from our guests and more, head over to Light Your Life podcast.com and be sure to bookmark this podcast is one of your favorites. I'm Tina Marie Saints here, founder of Bonfire Coaching and creator of the Bonfire Method. Thank you so much for being connected. Now my homework for you, summon the courage to light your life a little more and go make progress on your dreams. Today Out Your Life Podcast is brought to you by Bonfire Coaching. Bonfire Coaching is a system of tools, methodologies, and strategies that help each individual rise above the mundane life that feels efforting, where our mind will get stuck, have confusion, frustration, anger, fear, depression, anxiety, loneliness, and pain. And when we have that calling inside of ourselves for more in our life, where do we turn?

(54:23):

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